Sunday 28 February 2016

Fourth Meeting

4th Meeting Feb 28th 1870

 

Preamble.


 

Page 9L.


Transcript:

9.

Feb.28th 1870
Meeting held at Mr H Brunners.
Present - W.A. Watts, J.T. Brunner, E. Carey, H. Brunner, Muspratt H. Gaskell (visitor)
                 Words proposed for definition
Miracles Enthusiasm [fear] Bigotry Cant [??]
A miracle is an apparent violation of natural
law                                 Paulatim
Miracle is an apparent contradiction of
natural law                    Erin go Bragh
Miracle is an apparent violation of natural law
produced by supernatural power
                                      Palmam qui meruit ferat
Miracle is a direct manifestation of the divine
power, contrary to the [??] laws of nature
                                       Nemo
Miracle is the [??] of natural laws by
means which cannot be understood
                                        Spes
Miracle is a supposed manifestation of the
divine power contrary to the laws of Nature
                                       Onward & upward
                      ------------------------------
Feb 28th 1870

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Page 9R.


Transcript:

                                                                  9

Definition agreed to unanimously
That which is believed to be  a violation of natural
law
                      ----------------------------------
                               Zeal
Zeal is ardent desire to give help
                                              Onward & upward
Zeal is passionate ardour in the pursuit of
anything                               Nemo
Zeal is energy accompanied by sobriety and
guided by reason                 Paulatim
Zeal. The endeavour to perform to the best
of one's abilities that which is dictated by reason
                                              Spes
Zeal. Active enthusiasm     Palmam qui meruit [ferat]
Zeal is a pursuit of any object irrespective of
consequences                        Erin go Bragh

                               Enthusiasm
                               ----------------
Enthusiasm is excitement developed in the
endeavour to gain an end.
                                            Onward & upward
Enthusiasm is excitement of the mind in pur-
-suit of some object inspiring extravagant hope
& confidence of success      Nemo

                                            Feb 28th 1870
                                            -------------------

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Page 10L.


Transcript:
10
Enthusiasm is energy without sobriety & guided
by instinct                             Paulatim
Enthusiasm. Violent passion of the mind in
pursuit of some object         Spes
Enthusiasm is the [possession] of the mind by
an idea                                  Palmam qui meruit ferat
Enthusiasm is the imagination excited by the
pursuit of any object            Erin go Bragh

                        Majority definition
Zeal is the active pursuit of an object guided
by reason                              Paulatim
                                              Spes
                                              Nemo

                         Minority definition
Zeal is the active pursuit of an idea
                                          Erin go Bragh
                                          Palmam qui meruit ferat
Zeal is the [resolve] which brought to the pur-
-suit of an object guided by reason
                                          Onward & upward
                                      ===================
Feb. 28th 1870
-------------------

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Sunday 14 February 2016

Third Meeting

3rd Meeting Feb 14th 1870

 

Preamble:

 

Five members only at this third meeting, Mond absent. Education, Superstition and Miracles were discussed, and it is apparent they were delicate topics requiring an element of caution in what was said. It was difficult to get unanimous agreement and a formal vote was taken to continue the discussion to 11pm.
 

Page 7R.


transcript:                                                                        7                                           

Feb 14th 1870

Meeting held at J.L.Muspratt's house.
Present. J.L. Muspratt (chairman), H. Brunner,
J.T.Brunner, W.A. Watts, E. Carey
"Education" Definitions proposed.
The cultivation & development of the human
faculties.                                      Onward & upward
Education is the drawing forth & training
of all the faculties of the body & mind
                                                      Palman qui meruit ferat
Education is the systematic drawing out &
training of the powers of the mind.
                                                       Nemo
Education is a knowledge of facts.
                            Erin go Bragh
Education is the development of useful powers.
                                                        Paulatim.
Education. Definition agreed to.
Education is the process of bringing to perfection
the powers of intelligent beings.
                                                        Passed unanimously

                       -------------------------------------

                                                        Feb 14th 1870

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Page 8L. 



transcript:

8
"Superstition" Definitions proposed.
Superstition is the belief in that which is
contrary to the weight of evidence.
                                                    Onward & upward
Superstition is belief grounded on insufficient
evidence.                                 Palman qui meruit ferat
Superstition is the belief in anything which
is not supported by scientific evidence.
                                                 Erin go Bragh
Superstition is the belief in that which implies
a low conception of the Deity
                                                   Nemo
Superstition is belief in the supernatural
unwarranted by sufficient evidence.
Superstition                              Paulatim
               question put to the vote.
If the word supernatural & its equivalent is to be
based? on this definition
For. Palman qui meruit ferat, Onward & upward,
                         Nemo & Paulatim
Against. Erin go Bragh
Definition agreed to by Erin go Bragh & Onward & upward
Superstition is the belief in that which appears

Feb. 14th 1870

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Page 8R.




transcript:                                                                  8

contrary to the knoown laws of nature.
The above with the word"???? insufficient
evidence" was agreed to by Palman qui etc &
            Minority                      Paulatim.
Nemo also adhered to his own definition
Each ??? of these proposed by J.L.Muspratt & seconded
by J.T.Brunner "That this meeting be continued
till eleven o'clock.
                       ------------------------------------
Miracle  Definitions proposed
Miracle is a phenomenon beyond the powers
of human beings to produce, called into?
existence to demonstrate a proposition.
                                               Palman qui meruit ferat
Miracle is that phenomenon which is contrary
to the laws of nature            Erin go Bragh
Miracle is a direct manifestation of the divine
power contrary to the known laws of nature.
                                                 Nemo
Miracle is a phenomenon which is an infraction
of a law of nature                 Onward & upward
Miracle is an apparent violation of natural
law                                          Paulatim
                        ------------------------------
                        ------------------------------
                                                        Feb. 14th 1870

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Next meeting February 28th 

Thursday 4 February 2016

Second Meeting

Qu'est-ce que c'est? Club

Second Meeting: 4th Feb. 1870

Preamble.

Considering the small size of the group the second meeting reveals an enthusiasm for rules & procedure! One wonders what Mond made of all this.

Motto names adopted

As at the first meeting on January 26th, the participants adopted mottoes to identify themselves. It's never said why this was done, and the association with names appears only in pencil notes by Eustace Carey and are not part of the minutes proper.
Early encryption!

From the pencil notes of Eustace Carey,

Mottoes adopted

Mond (Ludwig)                         Unversagt (Undaunted)
Brunner (John)                          Onward and Upward
Brunner (Henry)                       Nemo (Nobody)
Carey (Eustace)                        Paulatim (Little-by-little)
Watts (Walter Angus)               Palmam qui meruit ferat (Let him who deserves it bear the palm)
Raven (James)                          Gradatim (gradually)
Muspratt (James Liebig)          Erin go bragh!
*Muspratt (Sydney)                 Sans changer (Unchanging)
*Jekyll**                                  Nescio quid (I know not what)
*Holbrook Gaskell II               Spes

*   Guest
** Chemist Gaskell, Deacon Laboratory

Page 2L. 



transcript:

2.
Feb. 4th 1870

Meeting held at Mr. Carey's house. Present -
Messrs Carey, Muspratt, Brunner, J., Brunner
& Watts. S. Muspratt a visitor. Chairman Mr Carey

Words proposed for definition
Art, Poetry, Taste, Superstition, Miracles, Originality,
Eccentricity

The following words were considered. Art, Poetry.
It was proposed and carried unanimously
that the following addition be made to the rules?
1. First that we begin punctually at 8 P.M. &
cease discussion at 10 30 P.M. The meeting to
close not later than 11. P.M.
The Rules proposed at the last meeting by Mr Watts
were considered & after some amendments
finally adopted.
_______________________________

Feb. 4th 1870

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Page 2R. 

 



transcript:

2
Rules as finally adopted.

1. The name of the club shall be the "Qu'est ce
que c'est"? club.
2. The meetings shall be held at the houses of
the members  alternately; the object being to
propound & discuss the definitions of various
words.
3. The members shall be invited to attend by
the host of the evening, who may invite, in
addition, any friends; but no person shall
be considered a member unless he shall
have been accepted unanimously by the
members present at any ordinary meeting.
4. The host of the evening shall be chairman, the
chairmen of the previous meeting to act as
secretary, & continue in office until the ensuing
meeting; unless & until a permanent
chairman or secretary be appointed.
5. The chairman's duty shall be to call the
meeting; to prepare & forward to each member
prior to the day of the meeting, a list of words
for definition (say six? words) to preserve
order at the meeting & to endeavour to attain

Feb 4th 1870

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Page 3L. 


transcript:
3
some agreement upon a definition to be adopted
of each word submitted.
6. The duty of the secretary shall be to preserve
minutes of the proceedings, to record and preserve
the several definitions, as well as the one
finally adopted, if any, and to arrange for the
next meeting of the club, if none shall
have been appointed at the last meeting.
7. Each member present at the meeting call
submit a written definition of the word
under consideration (which shall be taken
from the list prepared by the chairman)
signed by a motto, & which motto shall
designate all his definitions, & he shall be
allowed to speak in support of his definition
as often as may be necessary, but not to engage
in desultory remarks.
8. Each word on the list, so far as time may allow,
shall be taken separately, according to any order
that may be agreed upon, each member having
written his definition, the paper shall be
folded and drawn out by lot, & shall be read by
the chairman. The subject shall the be dis-

Feb 4th 1870

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Page 3R.


transcript:

3

-(dis)cussed in order, if possible to arrive at a definition
from which may be accepted by all. Should unanimity
be unattainable, the vote of the majority
shall be taken by /// & the definition recorded
with the voter, subject to the right of the majority
on any position of theirs?, to place a minority
definition or definitions on record.
9 Should disagreement or doubt arise as to the
ordinary meaning or grammatical construction
of any word, reference shall be made to a
standard dictionary, which appeal shall be final.
10 The meetings shall commence punctually at
8 P.M. and all discussion of the definitions shall
cease at 10 30. The meeting to close not later
than 11 P.M.

4th Feb 1870

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Page 4L.


transcript:

4

Art

Definitions proposed
Beauty portrayed             Paulatim
Art is the mode of conveying an idea or
sentiment of the mind through the medium of
the imaginative faculties.
        Palmam qui meruit ferat
Art is the faculty of giving expression to ideas
according to certain fixed? rules
                Nemo
That talent? which appreciates purity of style in
painting, music or sculpture?
                Erin go Braugh
Works? expressive of Beauty        Onward & Upward
Art is that which everybody admires  & yet
which few people can perform or do
                Sans changer
Vote taken whether "Art" expresses the sense? of  ob-
-taining a certain result //////
For the "Art"?  Nemo, Sans changer
                    Onward & Upward, Erin go Bragh
                    Palmam qui meruit fera.......} 5
For the "result?" Paulatim ……………} 1

Feb 4th 1870

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Page 4R.


transcript:

4
Vote taken on ? whether the ordinary notion? of
beauty is necessarily involved in the idea of Art
Ayes           Paulatim                   1
No --- Nemo, Onward & Upward, Erin go Bragh
Palmam qui etc. Sans changer                    5
For the definition "Art" is the mode of conveying
Palman qui etc. sentiment of the mind through
the medium of the imaginative faculties
Palman qui etc.  Erin go Bragh, Sans
changer ---------------------------------- 4
For the definition Art is work experience of
Beauty. Onward & Upward            1
For the definition "Art is beauty portrayed
                Paulatim            1
           -----------------------------------------

"Poetry" 

Definitions proposed
That division of art which relates to human
feeling            Paulatim
That form of language which expresses ideas
in words following each other in regular ///
                Erin go Bragh
The expression in language of beautiful fluency
                Onward & upward
The result of art expressed by means of language

Feb 4th 1870

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Page 5L.


transcript:

5
in? composition or rhetoric. Poetry is //
/// put into regularity & harmony? of outward forms.        Palmam qui meruit ferat
no definitions were submitted by Nemo & Sans changer
            ----------------------------------------------------------
Vote taken whether Poetry implies combination
of the expression of ideas within the form(ul) of expression

Ayes    Erin go bragh
           Nemo
           Palmam qui meruit ferat                } 3

No        Onward & Upward
             Paulatim
             Sans changer        } 3

Vote taken on whether poetry must be expressed in language

Ayes    Erin go bragh
           Nemo
           Palmam qui meruit ferat
           Onward & Upward
           Sans changer            } 5

No        Paulatim                   1

Definition proposed. Poetry is the expression
of artistic ideas, by means of language in
certain forms combining regularity and

Feb 4th 1870

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Page 5R.


transcript: 

5

harmony          Nemo
                        Erin go bragh
                        Palmam qui meruit ferat        } 3
For the definition Poetry is the expression in
language of beautiful fluency.
                    Onward and Upward
                    Sans changer        } 2

For the definition Poetry is that division of art which relates too human feeling.
                    Paulatim           } 1

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Feb 4th 1870

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